Hmmm, don't know how to comment on a comment, I hope this reaches you. May I say that you sound like the parent we all wish we had had, and would wish for our students to have? You are so tuned into your child and know him so well. I homeschooled my own daughter for not quite three years because school seemed like a bad fit for a number of reasons --- for example, her response to nervousness was an instantaneous need to pee, which needless to say was rather difficult to manage in the standard first grade classroom. (Oddly it was not an issue in kindergarten). She decided that she wanted to return in the spring of her third grade year, and that was that.
All during this time, I did insist that we be on time to doctor's appointments, movies, dance lessons, and even play dates, because I wanted to model respect for others. I would imagine that it would be hard to untangle the various aspects of what contributed to your son's bad reaction to school, but hey, punctuality it not something that the school invented, and at least since the Industrial Revolution it has been vital to the way society is organized. Do some struggle mightily with it? Yes! From the point of view of human evolution, it happened yesterday. But you wouldn't let your child ignore traffic (motorized vehicles being another of those recent developments) because he didn't feel like acknowledging it, would you?
I got the comment and I appreciate your thoughtful reply! Curious about your homeschooling journey as well (my goal is to continue this until my kid tells me he'd rather go back to school).
I agree with you that punctuality is an important aspect of living in society, but I think there's a big difference between safety (i.e. ignoring traffic) and inconveniencing others through lateness.
The thing is, we aren't late for the dentist, birthday parties, or extra-curriculars. We arrive on time at the theatre, at friends' homes, at the weekly nature school my kid attends which starts quite early. Even when the appointment is unpleasant, like a booster shot, I'm able to talk to my child about why it's important and get him to understand. He understands the importance of being on time, because I'm a person who hates running late.
The only place he truly hated going to and needed to be dragged to was school. It was a daily torture. He said some extremely dark things about how going to school made him feel, and I didn't want to be put into a position where I was constantly telling him that I cared less about his feelings than I did about the school's.
After countless calls, meetings and emails about how school was affecting him and how extremely upset and worried we were about him, they really could have worked with us to make the lateness thing a bit easier for everyone to manage. To be clear, we weren't late every day. It happened once or twice a week, on average.
They could have said, for example, "we know that this is a struggle for you, but we need you to understand that we still have to write you up for lateness. We're warning you so that you're not blindsided by stern official letters." I can't tell you how demoralizing those letters were, when they would arrive randomly without any personal note to accompany them, as if we hadn't met with them ten times about trying to salvage his school year.
Or, they could have said "it's disruptive when he arrives during our morning lesson. If you can't get here by 8:30, aim to arrive half an hour later during our first break in activities, to minimize disruption."
Or, they could have said "on Thursdays we have a social skills class and your kid could really benefit from that, so if you can only be on time a few times this week, please try to make Thursday one of those days."
I don't mean to harp on the school. It's not an awful place. Many of our neighbours' kids have a wonderful experience there. And I have huge respect for teachers (some of my best teachers absolutely changed my life and I'll remember them to my dying day). I know that his school was trying, with limited resources and within rigid rules, to help us. But we could never get past the point where they expected us to automatically enforce their priorities at home. It's such an ingrained aspect of the relationship, but it was impossible for me to accept.
Ummm . . . teacher here. May I enter a plea on behalf of punctuality? We are not being arbitrary and mean, we want class to run smoothly, and when kids come late, it interrupts and distracts --- everyone loses. Also, part of what one learns at school are social skills like the need to be places on time, and yes, it's hard. So are most other skills.
That said, I completely agree that playing the child against the parent in the way you have described is despicable, manipulative, and counterproductive in the extreme. Among other things, it may teach a child to not trust adults.
I definitely agree with you that for the teacher, punctuality is a reasonable priority, for all the good reasons you list above. And I did empathize with the school's position, up to a point.
But his punctuality wasn't (and couldn't be) my priority.
For me the context was this: my son was deeply miserable and came home from school every day saying things like "I hate school and I hate myself." I was extremely troubled by his moods, his negative self talk, and his constant emotional disregulation, all of which were new to us, and related only to his time at school (we didn't see these behaviours in after-school club, or extra-curriculars, camps, etc).
My priority was ensuring that he was happy, that he didn't hate himself or his hours spent at school, and that he was generally developing a love of learning. On the days when we were late, the alternative wasn't punctuality, it was not attending at all. Those days were victories for me, because I had given him a bit of extra space and time in the morning to build up his resilience for the day, and talked him into giving it another go.
I understood that punctuality was the school's priority, but they were aware of the above context. I explained it to them in person and in writing multiple times, so I know that they they knew my priority was his mental and emotional wellbeing, and that sometimes that was directly opposed to their priority of punctuality. And yet they continued to try to make me enforce their priority over my own, all school year. It's just one example of the sort of "parent-and-school-against-child dynamic" that I wanted to avoid.
That is outrageously harmful behavior on the teacher’s parent. This really resonates for me today. Got an email from my son’s teacher informing of an “incident”: he came back from the washroom and danced across the carpet back to his seat, “causing his friends to laugh,” and can we please talk to him about “appropriate behavior.” Is that not insane?! He’s 5!!
Oh, that is truly insane. I hope you reply to let this teacher know that dancing and making one’s friends laugh IS actually COMPLETELY APPROPRIATE behaviour for a five year old! (And really shouldn’t be considered inappropriate at any age but that’s perhaps a different point.)
Hmmm, don't know how to comment on a comment, I hope this reaches you. May I say that you sound like the parent we all wish we had had, and would wish for our students to have? You are so tuned into your child and know him so well. I homeschooled my own daughter for not quite three years because school seemed like a bad fit for a number of reasons --- for example, her response to nervousness was an instantaneous need to pee, which needless to say was rather difficult to manage in the standard first grade classroom. (Oddly it was not an issue in kindergarten). She decided that she wanted to return in the spring of her third grade year, and that was that.
All during this time, I did insist that we be on time to doctor's appointments, movies, dance lessons, and even play dates, because I wanted to model respect for others. I would imagine that it would be hard to untangle the various aspects of what contributed to your son's bad reaction to school, but hey, punctuality it not something that the school invented, and at least since the Industrial Revolution it has been vital to the way society is organized. Do some struggle mightily with it? Yes! From the point of view of human evolution, it happened yesterday. But you wouldn't let your child ignore traffic (motorized vehicles being another of those recent developments) because he didn't feel like acknowledging it, would you?
I got the comment and I appreciate your thoughtful reply! Curious about your homeschooling journey as well (my goal is to continue this until my kid tells me he'd rather go back to school).
I agree with you that punctuality is an important aspect of living in society, but I think there's a big difference between safety (i.e. ignoring traffic) and inconveniencing others through lateness.
The thing is, we aren't late for the dentist, birthday parties, or extra-curriculars. We arrive on time at the theatre, at friends' homes, at the weekly nature school my kid attends which starts quite early. Even when the appointment is unpleasant, like a booster shot, I'm able to talk to my child about why it's important and get him to understand. He understands the importance of being on time, because I'm a person who hates running late.
The only place he truly hated going to and needed to be dragged to was school. It was a daily torture. He said some extremely dark things about how going to school made him feel, and I didn't want to be put into a position where I was constantly telling him that I cared less about his feelings than I did about the school's.
After countless calls, meetings and emails about how school was affecting him and how extremely upset and worried we were about him, they really could have worked with us to make the lateness thing a bit easier for everyone to manage. To be clear, we weren't late every day. It happened once or twice a week, on average.
They could have said, for example, "we know that this is a struggle for you, but we need you to understand that we still have to write you up for lateness. We're warning you so that you're not blindsided by stern official letters." I can't tell you how demoralizing those letters were, when they would arrive randomly without any personal note to accompany them, as if we hadn't met with them ten times about trying to salvage his school year.
Or, they could have said "it's disruptive when he arrives during our morning lesson. If you can't get here by 8:30, aim to arrive half an hour later during our first break in activities, to minimize disruption."
Or, they could have said "on Thursdays we have a social skills class and your kid could really benefit from that, so if you can only be on time a few times this week, please try to make Thursday one of those days."
I don't mean to harp on the school. It's not an awful place. Many of our neighbours' kids have a wonderful experience there. And I have huge respect for teachers (some of my best teachers absolutely changed my life and I'll remember them to my dying day). I know that his school was trying, with limited resources and within rigid rules, to help us. But we could never get past the point where they expected us to automatically enforce their priorities at home. It's such an ingrained aspect of the relationship, but it was impossible for me to accept.
Ummm . . . teacher here. May I enter a plea on behalf of punctuality? We are not being arbitrary and mean, we want class to run smoothly, and when kids come late, it interrupts and distracts --- everyone loses. Also, part of what one learns at school are social skills like the need to be places on time, and yes, it's hard. So are most other skills.
That said, I completely agree that playing the child against the parent in the way you have described is despicable, manipulative, and counterproductive in the extreme. Among other things, it may teach a child to not trust adults.
I definitely agree with you that for the teacher, punctuality is a reasonable priority, for all the good reasons you list above. And I did empathize with the school's position, up to a point.
But his punctuality wasn't (and couldn't be) my priority.
For me the context was this: my son was deeply miserable and came home from school every day saying things like "I hate school and I hate myself." I was extremely troubled by his moods, his negative self talk, and his constant emotional disregulation, all of which were new to us, and related only to his time at school (we didn't see these behaviours in after-school club, or extra-curriculars, camps, etc).
My priority was ensuring that he was happy, that he didn't hate himself or his hours spent at school, and that he was generally developing a love of learning. On the days when we were late, the alternative wasn't punctuality, it was not attending at all. Those days were victories for me, because I had given him a bit of extra space and time in the morning to build up his resilience for the day, and talked him into giving it another go.
I understood that punctuality was the school's priority, but they were aware of the above context. I explained it to them in person and in writing multiple times, so I know that they they knew my priority was his mental and emotional wellbeing, and that sometimes that was directly opposed to their priority of punctuality. And yet they continued to try to make me enforce their priority over my own, all school year. It's just one example of the sort of "parent-and-school-against-child dynamic" that I wanted to avoid.
That is outrageously harmful behavior on the teacher’s parent. This really resonates for me today. Got an email from my son’s teacher informing of an “incident”: he came back from the washroom and danced across the carpet back to his seat, “causing his friends to laugh,” and can we please talk to him about “appropriate behavior.” Is that not insane?! He’s 5!!
Oh, that is truly insane. I hope you reply to let this teacher know that dancing and making one’s friends laugh IS actually COMPLETELY APPROPRIATE behaviour for a five year old! (And really shouldn’t be considered inappropriate at any age but that’s perhaps a different point.)